Xenotar with 6 lenses

[Marco]

If I want to buy a 3.5F with a Xenotar with 6 lenses from which serial number I will find fitted?

All the best
Marco

[Lordcroker]

Hi Marco.
So far as I am aware only the Planar lens was upgraded to six elements, the Xenotar was left as a 5 element design. I also understand that the F2.8 models retained 5 element lenses regardless of them being Planar or Xenotar.

If you ask 10 Rollei enthusiasts what the change was in the 5 and 6 element designs and when it occured you will get 10 different answers! Some say that ALL Planar 3.5 F's are six element, some say none were, others say the change occured in 1964, others say 1969.

According to some the sixth element was simply a plain UV filter, according to others it was a complete redesign to either improve centre illumination and /or edge resolution when used wide open.

Whether or not the redesign really made much noticeable improvement is another bone of contention!

From my best understanding the 6 element lens came in on the Planar 3.5F type 4 starting with serial number 2,815,051.

If anybody else has more concrete information I would also be interested as I have been trying to work the mystery out for a long time!

[Marco]

Hi Lordcroker,
My question is started from the "Rollei 75 Years book" written by Mr. Prochnow:
[quote]
"Of course there were other improvements that had their share in the great success of the "F" models. One of these was the new, six-element Planar 75mm F3.5 lens which was introduced rather quietly with the third version of the 3.5F. Shortly after, Schneider followed with a 75mm Xenotar F3.5, likewise made up of six elements. The new optical formulas served to meet the performance data guaranteed to Rollei, which were difficult to attain with only five element. Production costs remained unchanged. The 80mm F2.8 Planar and Xenotar lenses did not have these problems and thus retained their five
elements."
[/quote]

So Mr. Prochnow says that after the Planar also the Xenotar was build with 6 lenses, like you say on the Planar there are many different answers, but on the Xenotar I was not able to find nothing.
In a italian book from Angelo Derqui is also written that all the E3 model where fitted with 6 lenses Planar and Xenotar the production of the E3 started in 1961 and stopped in 1965.
The third batch of 3.5F started in dicember 1960 with s/n 2.250.000 (about same starting time of the E3 production) but in a lot of places is written that the starting camera with six lenses was the s/n 2.800.000 but this is the starting number of the fourth batch.

Now after your answer my question is :
Was a Xenotar with 6 lenses build? If yes from when?

[DPurdy]

I don't have a degree in Rollei history but for all the years I have been following Rollei lore and reading the books I have, the general concensus has always been that the 6th element was added to both the 3.5 Planar and 3.5 Xenotar at the start of E3. There is a lot of disagreement over the reason and value of the 6th element. Some say it was added to make the lens better for color film and is pretty much only UV control. Others say it was added to make the lens less expensive to produce and still maintain quality. And others think it is a significant imporvement. I can only say from my experience that the 3.5 Xenotar from an E2 was exceptionally sharp, handled color and contrast well. It was perhaps a little blue and could use a warming filter for color transparency. And maybe it flared from skylight a tiny bit more than the 2.8 Xenotar.

[Lordcroker]

To add some of my personal opinions on the purpose of the fabled Sixth element, using no hard facts at all.........

I find it very hard to believe that it is a UV filter. If it was, then why only fit it to the 3.5F and not the top of the Line 2.8F?
Indeed why go to the cost of an extra piece of glass at all? A UV filter is just a piece of plain optical glass with a coating that absorbs UV light. Surely UV absorbing properties could have been incorporated into the lens coating like they are today and then applied to all models to make a good selling point. After all these were the twilight years of the Rolleiflex and they really needed every selling point that they could lay their hands on to stay ahead of the competition.

Rollei were also very secretive about the Sixth element. The fact that 45 years on we are still debating whether it exists and indeed what it does shows that it wasn't something launched in a blaze of publicity.
Why would this be?
I can only assume that the extra element somehow must have improved the F3.5 lens, which would have made the public suspect that there was something inherently wrong with the previous version. Hence the secretiveness.
Nobody ever complained about the 5 element F3.5 Planar though and even now many people say that there really is no difference in image quality. I can't really give an authoritative view on the matter as my camera has a 6 element lens..... I think!!

I'm also surprised that the general consensus is that the Xenotar gained the extra element. Everything that I have heard before went against that by saying that the Xenotar remained a 5 element.

Anyway, back to the original question. To be sure all I can advise is that you buy one with as late a serial number as possible!

[nekotak]